Thursday, 3 May 2012

A Research Note on Origin of Bengali Kulin Brahmins


A Research Note on Origin of Bengali Kulin Brahmins
By
Dr. KK Debnath, Ph.D.
(drkkdebnath@gmail.com)

Abstract:
This is a pure research article of academic interest. An attempt has been made to trace the origin of “Kulin Brahmins” of Bengal, which has been evolved in Bengal around the end of 11th century. The author has considered various aspects as available in Vedic and Sramanic culture prevailing in India from ancient period. An analytical procedure has been adopted to find out the roots of Kulin Brahmins. Author is of the opinion that they are of indigenous origin and various stories have been developed over a period of time, due to various socio-political environments. In this study exceptions are ignored.
Author is grateful to historians, researchers, and contrutors in Google, without which it would not have been possible to carry out research towards this article.
Introduction:
It is very interesting to note in the cultural history of Bengal is primarily dominated by “Kulin Brahmins”, be it literary field, or scientific field or Medical or Engineering field or in Judiciary area or in administrative area or in political area. In other words the history of Bengal cannot be thought of without them, due to their immense contribution to the Bengali society. The list of these great Bengali Kulin Brahmin contributors is endless. However a small list is prepared and made available in annexure for ready reference at the end of this article.
This interesting factor made the author to trace the root to the extent possible, of this race as they claim that they are migratory Bengalis and not original native of Bengal.
However, it is extremely difficult as we need the data from religious history, cultural history, political history and social history of Bengal and its adjoining area to arrive at certain inference, provided all data are found to converge.

Indian history is found to be written, based primarily on Vedic literatures, Max Muller theory and various books authored by Europeans. Books written by Europeans are again based on their interviews with prominent people, hearsay and on Vedic literatures. While doing so the Sramanic/Sarmanic literature has been ignored. This may be due to the reason that during the development of Indian or Bengal history, the then civil society was dominated by Vedic people.
Vedic people are those people, who are believers of Vedic sanskriti and follow the Vedic social rules in their day to day life, and society is controlled and governed by Vedic intellectuals, who are known as Brahmins. They ranked at the top of the society. Among these Brahmins Kulin Brahmins occupy the highest position.
On the other hand there is no information available for people of other communities/castes. Informations and records are available only for Brahmins and it may not be possible to trace the origin of other community
However, modern historians and researchers have found out many interesting facts and author has tried to collect all these data and analyze them.


Various Classes of Brahmins from religion:
In North India Brahmins are found to be divided in five categories. These are 1) Saraswat Brahmins, 2)Konoujee Brahmins, 3) Maithili Brahmins, 4) Gauriya Brahmins and 5) Utkali Brahmins. 
1) Saraswat Brahmins: These are the Brahmins originated from the valley of Great Rig Vedic river Saraswati, used to flow through North western part of undivided India. Most of the Kashmiri and Panjabi Brahmins belong to this class of Brahmins.
2) Konoujee Brahmins: These are the Brahmins originated from Kanauj, situated in Panchal area (between river Ganga and Yamuna), presently in UP.
3) Maithili Brahmins: These Brahmins are originated from Mithilanchal area of ancient Bengal. Mithila was the capital of Upanishadic and Puranic king Janak. King Janak was the father of Sita maa of puranic Ramayana. Mithila is now a part of present Bihar state.
4) Gauriya Brahmins: These Brahmins are originated from Gaur. Gaur was ancient capital of Bengal and it is situated in karna subarna part of Bengal.  The area covered by present Maldah , Dinajpur and Bagura district of West Bengal and Bangla desh.
5) Utkali Brahmins: The Brahmins are originated from Puri area of ancient Utkal desh (present Orissa or Odisha). However Utkali Brahmins opines that their ancestors migrated from Gangeya Valley of North India.


Kula Panjika (Family Dictionary) records:
Kanoujee Brahmins:
According to family dictionary, Bengali Kulin Brahmins are not original inhabitants of Bengal. They migrated from Kanouj at the invitation of king Adisur of Bengal in late 11th century. Some Kulin Brahmins claim that they migrated to Bengal around 14th century at the invitation of king Adisur. Many also believes that Kulin Brahmins migrated around 10th Century.
The reason was justified by them, stating that  there was no Vedic Brahmin available in Bengal to perform Vedic rituals for the king. Later on the did not return to their native place and permanently settled in Bengal around Rarh or Radha area. The present Bardhaman, Birbhum area is known as Rarh area. They are all Upadhyaya Brahmins.

Gauriya Brahmins:
Gauriya Brahmin people are found to be settled in U.P. , Delhi, Haryana, Panjab, Gujrat, Maharashtra, and Konkon areas of India.
According to their family history they migrated from Gaur_Bangal of Bengal to Hastinapur during Mahabharata period. King Janmejaya the son of King Parikhsheet, wanted to perform “Sarpa Yagna” to kill all the snakes of the World to take revenge of the death of his father by snake bite. Since there was no Vedic Brahmin available in Hastinapur he invited 100 learned Brahmins from Gaur of Bengal to perform the Vedic ritual of “Sarpa Yagna”. These Brahmins were treated so nicely that they decided to settle at Hastinapur itself instead of returning to Gaur. They got married with locals of that place and as a result they are rough in their look with respect to Bengali Brahmins. Mahabharata war took place around 1000 BC according to historians. Therefore this migration must have been taken place around 1000 BC.

Maithili Brahmins:
Sage Yagnavalkya, Gautama and other learned Brahmins of Upanishads were at the court of King Janaka of Mithila. The accepted period of Upanishad by historians and researchers is around 700 BC. Mithila was a part of ancient Bengal. According to Jain literature 22nd jain Tirthamkara Lord Nemi Nath was born at Mithila of Bangadesh. Historically, Lord Krishna was a cousin brother of Lord Nemi Nath.
Utkali Brahmins:
They say their ancestors migrated to Utkal from Gangeya valley long back. This indicates that they are not original inhabitants of Utkal desh.

Analysis of the above:
Let us assume the migration theory is in order. In such case there was no Vedic Brahmins in Bengal, as a result one king by name Adisur invited learned Brahmins of Kanouj to come and settle in Bengal.
On the other hand, we find
1) Learned Brahmins like Yagnavalkya and others, who had composed the great philosophies as detailed in Upanishads, lived in this very Bangadesh at around 700 BC almost 1400 to 1500 years ago of king Adisur. This shows there was no shortage of learned people or Brahmins in Bengal some 1500 years prior to King Adisur.
2)  Learned Brahmins were invited from Bengal by the king of Hastinapur Janmejaya (Son of king Pareekhsheet and grandson of great pandava Arjuna) at around 1000 BC, ie. More than 2000 yrs prior to king Adisur of Bengal. This also indicates that there was no shortage of Brahmins in Bengal even 2000 years ago.

Besides the above, historians could not trace out a king by name Adisur of Bengal at any point of time who invited Vedic Brahmins from Kanouj to Bengal.
Historians could not find any trace of migration of learned Vedic Brahmins from Bengal during Mahabharata period.
The story is similar for other categories of Brahmins.
Therefore, it appears that there are a lot of contradictions and these occurred probably due to the fact that only Brahmins were literate as they were only eligible to read and write. Others were not allowed to do so due to religious strictures of Vedic religion. This has also allowed Brahmins to record and documented the social rules and literatures in their own way. As a result it becomes extremely difficult to trace the history of origin of this community.  
Therefore, it is necessary to look in to the details of AIT, political situation, social structure and the religious development in Bengal.


Historical information:
1) Aryan Connection:
Historians of 18th century were found to be mesmerized by Great German Scholar Max Muller. He was to be credited as the father of Indian history. He founded the theory of Aryan invasion (AIT) to Indus valley and spread the story of mixed blood of Aryan race and Indian race. Aryans were described as the best people of a great race in the World. Indian scholars also accepted this theory without any question, probably with an impression that, this would enhance their prestige in the society.
2) Ancient Political situation:
According to historians Kulin Brahmanism appeared in Bengal from the time of king Ballal Sena and no historical evidence found on Kulin Brahmins prior to Sena period.
Prior to Senas Bengal was ruled by Palas who were primarily of Buddhist faith. But their ministers were found to be Brahmins who were Maithily Brahmins in line with present day classification. Prior to Palas it was king Sashanka who was a devout Saiva and he was against Buddhists.
Further, prior to Palas and Sashanka, it was under the rule of Guptas. According to some historians, Guptas originated from Gaur area (present Maldah district). Samudra Gupta embraced Vaishnavaism and got declared as Khastriya under Vedic system. They were against Buddhist and used carrot and stick policy to convert Buddhist into Vedic religion. One side people were forced to embrace Vedic religion and on the other side Buddha was declared as an avatar of Vishnu, to please Buddhists and to bring them under Vedic fold. During this Gupta period the famous Buddha temple with the foot print of Buddha at Gaya was renamed as Vishnu temple with foot print of Vishnu.
Prior to Guptas, Bengal was ruled by Mauryas. Their founder Chandragupta Maurya and his son Bindusar were followers of Jainism; however Asoka, the son of Bindusar embraced Buddhism.
3)  Religious Development in Bengal:
According to Sahityacharya Dinesh Ch. Sen and others the earliest religion of Bengalis was probably Jainism. Prior to Bardhaman Mahavir, Jain religion was known as Nath or Arihant or Arihat religion.
Out of 24 Teerthamkaras 18 of them spent major portion of their lives in this very Bengal. The district name “Bardhaman” was named after 24th Tirthamkara Bardhaman Mahavir.
Sahityacharya Dinesh ch. Sen stated that the earliest known religion of Bengalis was probably Jainism. This can further be substanciated that famous Jain scholar and monk “Bhadra bahu” was from present “Bagura” dist. of Bangladesh. He was rajguru of King Chandragupta Maurya, the founder of Mourya Dynasty. He made Chandragupta Maurya to become a monk and lead him to Sravanbelegola of Karnataka to lead a Sarmanic life. This also shows that there was no shortage of learned and intellectuals in Bengal at any point of time.

The next major religion of Bengalis found to be Buddhism, followed by Saivaism and Saktaism. Lord Shiva is also known as “Kaula” or “Akula”, while Sakti is known as “Kula”. Prior to Sena rules in Bengal, Bengal and its adjoining areas were dominated by Buddhist “Kula” tantraism and Saiva “Kula” tantraism. According to historians there was hardly any difference among these two sections of Tantraism.
It may be of interest to mention here that there are 51 Sakti/Tantra Peethas and four Adi Sakti Peethas found in undivided India.
The brief on these four Adi Sakti/Tantra Peethas are described below:


1. Puri Jagannatha, Puri at Orissa:
According to historians, it was originally a Buddhist shrine; this was converted to Vaishnava shrine at a later period.
For Sakta Tantric Jagannatha is Bhairava and Bimala is Bhairavi. In the month of Asvina, during the Durga Puja, animal sacrifice is made before goddess Bimala which is the only of its kind in the otherwise bloodless rituals performed in the temple. The holy food offered to Shri Jagannatha is sanctified only after it is presented to Bimala and then acquires the character of Mahaprasad. The Goddess Bimala, a manifestation of the Mother Goddess and considered as Shakti of Lord Jagannatha.  
Puri is a prime Hindu pilgrimage centre located in Orissa. It is famous for Rath Yatra held in the month of Sravana. The place is well connected by Rails. Pilgrims may get down either at Bhubaneswar or at Khurda road Jn. on Main Howrah Chennai railway line and go to Puri by road or by Train.

2. Tara Tarini, Raipura, Ganjam; Orissa:
According to historians and researchers, it was originally a Buddhist Tantric temple. Historically Tara and Tarini both are Buddhist Goddesses.
It is said that the breasts of Sati fell at the Kumari Hills where the famous Tara Tarini Shakti Pitha has stood. It is said that the breasts of Sati fell at the Kumari Hills
Tara-Tarini Temple is situated on the Top of the Kumari hills. This hill stands on the bank of River Rushikulya near Purushottampur in Ganjam District. It is one of the most Prominent ancient Shakti peetha or Tantra Pitha of Orissa and this Pitha is among four of most important Shakta centers in India and Orissa has been considered to be one of the most important Shakti centre.
The Goddesses Tara-Tarini has been regarded as the presiding deity (Ista-Devi) in almost every house in South Orissa.
Tara was the Primordial deity of the Mahayana Buddhist Pantheon, indicates Buddhist influence at the Tara - Tarini Peetha.


3. Kamakhya Kamroop, at present Assam:
Historically, it was a famous Buddhist Tantra Peetha.  At a later stage, it became the place of Sadhana of Lord Matsyendra Nath and a temple was made. He was the Guru of Lord Gorokhsha Nath, and Matsendra Nath is credited as the founder of “Kula System” of Tantra in Bengal.
The current temple structure was constructed in 1565 by Chila Rai of the Koch dynasty in the style of medieval temples. The form of the earlier structure, destroyed by the Kala Pahar, is unknown.
According to puranic story, Devi's yoni fell here. Idols of temple are Devi as Kamakhya (personification of love) and Shiva as Umananda.
The Kamakhya Temple is a Shakti temple situated on top of the Nilachal Hill in western part of Guahati city in Assam on the northern banks of the river Brahmaputra (the son of Brahma), India. It is the main temple in a complex. There are various   individual temples dedicated to different forms of the mother goddess as the Dasa Mahavidya, including Bhuvaneshvari, Bagalamukhi, Chinnamasta, Tripura Sundari and Tara also built in the temple complesx over a period of time. It is an important pilgrimage destination for general Hindu and Tantric worshipers.
This is also a famous pilgrimage for women seeking fertility or love. The temple is supposedly built by Kamdev, the god of love. The Umananda temple is nearby in an islet on the river. It has many pet monkeys.
During the Ambuvaci festival each summer, the menstruation of the Goddess Kamakhya is celebrated. During this time, the water in the main shrine runs red with iron oxide resembling menstrual fluid.
The Kalika Purana, an ancient work in Sanskrit describes Kamakhya as the yielder of all desires, the young bride of Shiva, and the giver of salvation. Shakti is known as Kamakhya.
The Kamakhya Temple in Assam symbolizes the "fusion of faiths and practices" of Brahmanism and native elements in Assam. The Yogini Tantra mentions that the religion of the Yogini Pitha is of Kirata origin. According to Assamese literature, there existed a tradition among the priests established by Nara Narayana that the Garos, a matrilineal people, offered worship at the Kamakhya site by sacrificing pigs.
The goddess is worshiped according to both the Vamachara (Left-Hand Path) as well as the Dakshinachara (Right-Hand Path) modes of worship. According to the Kalika Purana, Kamakhya Temple denotes the spot where Sati used to retire in secret to satisfy her amour with Shiva, and it was also the place where her yoni fell after Shiva danced with the corpse of Sati. However, this is not corroborated in the Devi Bhagavata, which lists 108 places associated with Sati's body, though Kamakhya finds a mention in a supplementary list. The Yogini Tantra, a latter work, ignores the origin of Kamakhya given in Kalika Purana and associates Kamakhya with the goddess Kali and emphasizes the creative symbolism of the yoni.

4.  Kalighat (Calcutta) at West Bengal:
As per historical records Lord Gorokhsha Nath, a great religious and social reformer of Saiva Nath religion, who converted left hand Tantra to right hand Tantra, by transforming the Tantric Kula Bhairavi in to mother Goddess.  His Guru Lord Matsendra Nath was the founder of Kula System in Bengal. One of his disciples Chourangi Nath used to look after this temple and was the first priest of it. His seat was named as Chourangi and the road from his ashram to temple was named as Chourangi road.

Devi's four small toes from her right foot fell here and the idols are Devi as Kali and Shiva as Nakulish or Nakuleswar. This famous pilgrimage centre is located in Calcutta in the state of West Bengal. Kali is described as dark complexioned form of Sakti who has taste for blood and death. She rules over the cremation sites and is worshipped by devotees on a dark and moon less night. She is most popular deity of Bengal. Kali is the female version of Kala or end of time.
Beside the above there are 9 nos. of Sakti Tantra Peethas in Bardhaman and Birbhum area of Bengal only.
Analysis:
According to historians and researchers, Tantra was developed originally by Buddhist, followed by jains, Saivas, Vaishnavites and at last by Vaidikis.
Due to the liberalization and intrinsic benefits for intellectual, this probably tempted intellectuals of Non Vedic religion and they could not resist themselves, which finally drives them to accept and embraced the Vedic path.
What is this intrinsic benefit? Researchers and Historians opines that it is only the caste factor in the society, because during this transition period at the time of Sena period, there was no difference between  Saiva tantra and Buddhist tantra, as far as spirituality is concerned. This can be observed from the history of Adi Sakti Peethas.
The main difference was in the society, the caste system made the descendents of a Brahmin automatically to become a Brahmins and thus the interests of descendents are found to be well protected. The same was found to be supported, encouraged and propagated through Bhagavat Gita. This probably made Senas to establish the Vedic rules of Brahminic Society without much trouble.
In such case why these Kulin Brahmins identify themselves as “Konoujee Brahmins” or migratories from Konouj.
The reason may be traced out in the contemporary period. Historically Konouj  and Mithila were  never dominated by Buddhism, even during the period of Harsha. After Mahabharata war, Mithila was the prominent centre of Vedic learning but from the period of Harshabardhana Konouj became most prominent centre of Vedic studies. Therefore one probable reason was simply to adopt the name of Konouj or these intellectuals were deputed to Konouj for Vedic studies and to adopt the same under socio-political condition of the then Bengal. I other words they became the Alumini of various Vedic school of studies and they were accorded various gotra names according to the various intellectuals of Vedic period.
On return from Konouj they were relocated, else there was probably a fear of not receiving due honor from the locals as the proverb says that  “Gharka Murgi daal barabar” or “Geyo Yohi Bhik pai naa”.

On Surnames and Gotra Surmanes:
In Buddhist society, intellectuals of very high orders used to be honored by “Upadhyaya” tile, whereas intellectuals of lower order used to be honored by “Acharya” title. On the other hand Vedic system follows reverse of Buddhist System. In Vedic system intellectuals of very high orders used to be honored by “Acharya” title and of lower order by “Upadhyaya”. Thus we find, Dronacharya, Kripacharya, Sankaracharya, Madhavacharya, Ramanujacharya, Ballavacharya etc, but not a single Upadhyaya.
On the other hand, it is interesting to note that in Bangadesha  Upadhyayas are highest rank holders among Brahmins, instead of Acharyas.
This again shows that Bengali Upadhyayas were probably Buddhist.

Another Clue: The Gotra name of Upadhyayas (Mukhopadhyaya, Bondopadhyaya, Chottopadhyaya, Gongopaddhyaya) are “Deva sarma”. What is this Deva Sarma?
As stated earlier, there were mainly two religious system were founded in India viz. Vedic religious system and Sramanic/sarmanic system. All non vedic religions like Nathism, Jainism, Buddhism, Saivaism, Saiva-nathism, Ajjevakism etc These non vedic religions were also termed as “Bratya” religion, due to various Bratas observed Bratyas throughout the year.
The Buddhist and Saiva intellectuals were commonly termed as “Sarmana”, and on sanskritization it becomes “Sarma”. Commoners used to respect them as “Devata” or Deva for performing priestly work with the hope that they can reach heaven only through them. Thus it appears that Deva Sarma became a common honor of Buddhist intellectuals involving in priestly work and also formulating the procedures of priestly work.

Thus all the historical and religious, and cultural parameters strongly indicates Upadhyayas were in fact originally of Buddhist religion. They probably adopted Nathism during the period of Matsendra Nath, the founder of “Kula” system of Mother Worship and Lord Gorokhsha Nath the founder Maa Kali temple of Kalighat. During this period they were honored by people as “Kulin” as Kulins were the people to establish all the system and procedures to perform “Kula Worship”. It may of interesting to note that the famous Bengali Buddhist Scholar “Atish Dipankar”, who also made the war pact between Palas and Cholas; embraced Nathism at the instance of Lord Matsendra Nath and became a disciple of him. Therefore it is beyond doubt that when a person like “Atish Dipankar”, former chief of Great Nalanda University embraced Nathism, other intellectuals of high caliber from Buddhism too joined him in embracing Nathism.
Finally these Kulins embraced Vedic religion at the time of Sena period due to various advantages made in Vedic social system as stated earlier.
It is interesting to note that there are about 23 Sakti Peethas out of a total of 51 Sakti Peethas found in this very Bangadesha and 9 Sakti Peethas are found in Bardhaman and Birbhum districts only. It is to the credits of these Upadhyayas or Kulins, who have established various Sakti Peethas or Kula Peethas in Bengal.
However the fact is that, while embracing the Vedic religion, they had not left any good features of their religion, like worship of Sakti or Kula, performing various Bratas throughout the year as well as food habits.  These Kulins they indigenized the Vedic religion accordingly.
Thus it may be inferred that all Bengali Brahmins including Kulins are of indigenous origin. These have been proved on the basis of biological system also.

Annexure: Notable Kulin Brahmins
Banerjee: 
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Chatterjee: 
ganguly: 
________________________________________________________
Mukherjee:
------------End------------- 

103 comments:

  1. Very informative. Keep up the good work

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  2. Sir, are Debnaths, naths , Pandits really Brahmins? I get many times humiliated stating that I am not a Brahmin as I am Pandit and my mom is Debnath. Can you kindly share some authentic sources (books/links) that tells the true story ? Many thanks in advance.

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    1. Debnath and Nath and Pandits are recognized by Bangiya Brahmin Samaj as "Rudraja Brahmins".... But originally Nath Samaj was casteless .

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    2. Dear Mr. Rudra,
      I do hope that you have gone thru the article, wherein it is mentioned that they were earlier Buddhist. They were probably scholars of high degree at various Universities like Nalanda, Vikramshila and after the fall of these great universities, they were relocated at various places... You may be aware that Tantra was originally developed by Buddhist and all were followers of "Kula" means Goddess Sakti. They were likely converted to Sakti group of Saivaism, as established by Lord Matsendra Nath and later on during the time of Sena dynasty, they were defined as "Kulin" and due to their scholarly knowledge they must had hold high position in the kingdom and were termed as "Brahman", means Knowledgeable... and Under Vedic system they were classified by Senas as "Kulin Brahmins"... Thank you.

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    3. Rudraja Brahmins are Koulas which means they are primarily devotees of Lord Rudra (who was later on mapped with Puranic God Shiva). They used to perform the religious work of house holders and in Temple. They also worship Kula (Goddess Sakti). They are now Hindus and were never Buddhists.
      Kulin Brahmins, are primarily devotees of KULA (Goddess Sakti), they joined Hinduism from Buddhism, probably under the influence of Lord Gorokh Nath, who along with his GURU Matsendra Nath fought against the evil practices of Sakti Sadhana of five "Ms", it may be noted that The Chief of Nalanda University and a prominant Buddhist Sree Atish Dipankar; after his return from Tibet noticed this evil practices and He too became a disciple of Matsendra Nath, It was Lord Matsendra Nath and Guru Gorokh Nath who changed the Sakti sadhana from "5Ms" by changing the status of Bhairavi from a sexual partner to the position of Mother Kalika. These learned disciples were commonly known as Kulin. ....
      This things happened prior to Sena rule. They Later on Ballala Sena categorized these learned people as Brahmins due to their quality in accordance with Vedic system... Gradually they became known as Kulin Brahmins.......Today's, Tara, Tarini, Bhairavi, Chinna Masta etc were Buddhist Goddess............. The following photos shows the primitive stages of Kula dharma (Failed to attach pictures of Goddess at various stages prior to the present form)......




      The First Stage (sitting)..


      The 2nd Stage ….. (Semi Standing)

      The present Stage…..




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  3. Dear Mr. Roy,

    Well,

    I have very limited knowledge on this.
    Debnath, Nath, Pandits actually do not belong to Vedic linage of Social System. they were against caste system. However Casteism has been adopted by majority of the people only during & after Lord Adi sankaracharya.
    Nathism is a casteless society of Saiva people and they had their own priests and intellectuals. At a later date these people (priests & intellectuals) took up the case and were recognized by Vedic Brahmins as Brahmins, after lots of study of Puranic literature. Naths, Debnaths and Pandits are recognized as Rudraj Brahmins by Brahmin Samaj of Kolkata and is registered. Therefore they are Brahmins.

    However, since basically it is a casteless society, you may find people of all professions in this religion, but all the people cannot be termed as Brahmins, I dont consider illiterates as Brahmins.
    Truly speaking, majority of Nath community (As on date) are illiterate and backward due to various circumstances. Backwardness is there in every community (Check Hindu/Vedic, Islam and Christian) of religion.

    Please be noted that Nath is a separate religion and the oldest religion of India and Vedic religion is a modified version of it, and Vedic religion was under constant refinement by modifying / upgrading it to match the requirement of the time and is still in this process. Whereas all others remains as it was and fallen backward.


    1) Ancient Nath (Founded by Lord Brishav Nath, AKA Lord Hrishav Nath , Lord Adi Nath) , Offshoots are Vedic, Primitive Nath.

    2) Primitive Nath, Offshoots are Ajeevaks, Jainism, Buddhissim, Naths, and Vedic
    3) Naths Offshoots are Saivas, Vedic.
    You may go thru my photo Album on “Why Kashi is the seat of Lord Shiva and Origin of Ishwara” with my Comments. I am sure you will get your answer.
    Thank You.

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    Replies
    1. Hello sir ! As you are also a Debnath so, what do you consider yourself as in a caste ? Or you also follow up the nath conspiracy not considering any caste ? And just seek and follow shiva !

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  4. Thanks for the information and visiting my site.Regds.

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  5. This comment has been removed by the author.

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  6. This is bullocks. Atish Dipankara was Buddhist not some Nath. Naths were saivite, someone cannot be a Nath and a Buddhist simultaneously. "Finally these Kulins embraced Vedic religion at the time of Sena period"... Kulins came from UP during Ballal Sen's time, and there rituals are very similar to UP Brahmins. There is no historical evidence showing Kulinism existed before the time of Ballal Sen. Please do not spread misinformation.

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    1. What is being said by you is only Story, and not an history.
      May refer to the books on Ancient history of India.

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    2. Well, Atish Dipankar initially was a Buddhist and a great scholar. Further No discussion on this issue..
      After his return from Tibet, he noticed that the Buddhism he know was changed and indulged in sexual activities in the name of Mokhsha (Kaala chakrayan)., He found Lord Matsendra Nath, who introduced Kula dharma (Sakti Worship) in place of the above wherein Bhairavi used by Buddhists as a sexual object and she became a disciple of Lord Matsendra nath.. Not only this, the entire Buddhist community of high intellectuality came under his influence and started Kula practice after becoming his disciple...
      It was Atish Dipankar, who had drafted the War pact of Palas with kaluchari king and accordingly, Kaluchari princess "Youvanshree" was married to Pala princes...
      We only know what is written in public history, but there are a lot of of hidden things, and one need to study and analyse the same....

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    3. Nath doesnot fall under the vedic caste.they dont study veda they dont have pravara etc..they use tantra for worship and brahmins use mantra thats the difference between brahmin and non brahmin. Your kbowledge is bullshit

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    4. Thank You Mr. Bakasur for your great knowledge and enligtenment, as expressed in your language.

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    5. Well said...The language used by him itself shows his class...Never mind if he is a brahmin..But language doesn't reflect that

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    6. Definitely....Indrani Ma'am.

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  7. Being debnath you r not sure u r rudraja brahmin. Guru bindunath is our gotrapita and matsendranath.. giru gorakhsanath r our gurus. THEY SPREAD THE NATH DHARMA THOUGHOUT NIRTH INDIA, WEST INDIA AND EAST INDIA AND SOUTH INDIA. PL REFER TO REASERCH BOOK BY DR,\. KALLYANI NMALLIK OF KOLKATA UNIVERSITY, +RESEARCH BOOK BY SURAJ SARATHI KAR+BOOK BY DR. DOL GOVIND SASTRY OF UTKAL UNIVERSITY. CONTACT THE SECRETARY MR. SANTOSH KR DEBNATH (EX OFFICIO DOORDARSHAN) OF NIKHIL BANGA RUDRAJA BRAHMIN SAMMILANI/PH NO---03324254083/8697584266/OR U.C DEBNATH PH--9433431083 THANKS S C DEBNATH/04-11-2015

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  8. Being debnath you r not sure u r rudraja brahmin. Guru bindunath is our gotrapita and matsendranath.. giru gorakhsanath r our gurus. THEY SPREAD THE NATH DHARMA THOUGHOUT NIRTH INDIA, WEST INDIA AND EAST INDIA AND SOUTH INDIA. PL REFER TO REASERCH BOOK BY DR,\. KALLYANI NMALLIK OF KOLKATA UNIVERSITY, +RESEARCH BOOK BY SURAJ SARATHI KAR+BOOK BY DR. DOL GOVIND SASTRY OF UTKAL UNIVERSITY. CONTACT THE SECRETARY MR. SANTOSH KR DEBNATH (EX OFFICIO DOORDARSHAN) OF NIKHIL BANGA RUDRAJA BRAHMIN SAMMILANI/PH NO---03324254083/8697584266/OR U.C DEBNATH PH--9433431083 THANKS S C DEBNATH/04-11-2015

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    Replies
    1. Dear Mr. Subhas Chandra Debnath,

      I think you are still in the World of History as introduced by European scholars. Most of the Indians are still following the same trail...

      Well, I am of different opinion, because of my own my research and analysys. I am not a professional historian and never followed the trail. My background is different. I am an Applied Mathematician, and a Doctorate in Applied Mathematics, but all my research papers were published in various International Journals of Engineering and Technology starting from Netherlands to USA and not in any Mathematical Journal..
      Professionally I was a System Analyst and a Corporate Business Planner.
      The above background facilitates me to think in a different way than the influenced historians.
      Well, I think you are well educated gentleman and therefore my sincere appeal to you to control your emotion while concluding about someone and writing the same, which also can be treated as an insult.. Well this also indicates the growth of of a person starting from childhood.

      Well, the issues raised by you may not be correct as per my own analysis.
      The origin of Naths is still under cloud, as the truth is very bitter and not easily digestible.
      I think Nathism was the most ancient religion of India, From which Vedic religion came out. The original Nathism was renamed at a much later date , as Arihant or Arihat or Arhat religion, which was further refined and Termed as Jain religion, and a religion evolved from that prior to Buddha, which was named as "Ajeevaka religion". Buddhism was also a derivative of Nath religion.
      For your kind information, Lord Krishna was a Nath so his brother Lord Nemi Nath the 22nd Tirthankara. Lord Mahavir used to be called as "Nath Putra", so is Lord Buddha.
      Saivism is also an offshoot of Nathism, Lord Shiva was mapped with the 1st Tirthankara and this was originated from Kashmir due to Issai Nath, who was no other than Lord Issa, the founder of Christianity... You cannot find out the name of Lord Shiva prior to 200 AD as a result of the above.

      Therefore Lord Matsendra Nath can not be said as a founder of Nath religion.

      Now another point, at present day Nathism can not be treated as a religion, as a religion has two aspects, one is Spiritual while the other is Temporal. Practically in all aspect Nathism now follows Vedic religion....

      I do hope with in a small space, My point is clear. In case you have any doubt, you may contact me with your experts and specialists (if necessary) on this issue and I am ready to discuss on this.

      Thank you.

      Delete
    2. “The fundamentals of this culture, which is essentially rooted in the yogic culture, what you call as Indian culture or Hindu culture is essentially a pure yogic science. In the form of culture, it finds many colors and distortions, which is what you’re seeing as the Hindu culture or Indian culture, whatever you want to call it.”

      — Jaggi Vasudev (born 3 September 1957), known publicly as Sadhguru, is an Indian yogi and author. In 2017, he was awarded the Padma Vibhushan.

      Delete
  9. Subhas Chandra Debnath,

    Well, you may be aware from Nath Literature about Batuk Nath, Issai Nath and other prominent Naths, It is also known that Lord Adi Sankar was engaged by Nath Siddhas (As per your reference only). If you are proud of these facts, then it is very clear that Nath Siddhs, Saints were present much earlier than Lord Matsendra Nath. Lord Adi Sankar was around 500 yrs earlier to Lord Matsendra Nath, and Lord Issai Nath was almost 1000 yrs earlier to him. therefore, you are requested study these and may arrive at certain conclusion, instead of carried out by others opinion and writings.
    Thank You.

    (Dr. KK Debnath)

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  10. We are Chakraborty,but we are Kulin Brahmin.Also Tagore family was derived from Kulin Brahmin(Pir Ali who converted to Muslim from Kulin).You have missed IVF pioneer Subhas Mukherjee who was Kulin Brahmin.There are 2 Pulitzer prize winners Brahmin from Bengal,Grammy award winners like(Ravishankar and his daughter Nora jones)Have you heard about Nobel laureate signature award winner Anirban Banerjee or world famous inventors like Arpan Chakraborty,Soma Chakraborty etc.

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    1. Chakraborty and Bhattacharya are not original surname. Any of the five Rarhi Shreni Brahmins e.g., Chattopadhyay, Gangopadhyay, Bandopadhyay, Mukhopadhyay and Ghoshal or the five Barendra Shreni Brahmin e.g., Bhaduri, Lahiri, Moitra, Sanyal & Bagchi can have Chakraborty or Bhattacharya "Upadhi" depending on what their forefathers did.....teaching in a "tol" or being the "Kul-purohit"

      Delete
    2. Your Gotra will tell what was your original surname....if Shandilya....u r a bandopadhyay, if, Bharadwaj, you r a Mukhopadhyay, if Kashyap, u r a Chatto, if Batsya, u r a Ghoshal......similarly for the Barendra Brahmins

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    3. Your Gotra will tell what was your original surname....if Shandilya....u r a bandopadhyay, if, Bharadwaj, you r a Mukhopadhyay, if Kashyap, u r a Chatto, if Batsya, u r a Ghoshal......similarly for the Barendra Brahmins

      Delete
    4. Chakraborty and Bhattacharya are not original surname. Any of the five Rarhi Shreni Brahmins e.g., Chattopadhyay, Gangopadhyay, Bandopadhyay, Mukhopadhyay and Ghoshal or the five Barendra Shreni Brahmin e.g., Bhaduri, Lahiri, Moitra, Sanyal & Bagchi can have Chakraborty or Bhattacharya "Upadhi" depending on what their forefathers did.....teaching in a "tol" or being the "Kul-purohit"

      Delete
    5. There was no concept of Surname in earlier days. It was introduced at a very later date. Most of the Barendra Kulins were probably settled around various Kula (Sakti) Peethas of ancient Bongadesha.

      Delete
    6. On Gotra system: It is ridiculous. No one can expect that these learned Hrishis had no other jobs except to produce children throughout India.
      It is wrongly being interpreted. The ancestors of people of a particular Gotra might have excelled in learning from a particular school of Vedic studies, viz. Bharadwaj school of vedic studies etc.

      Delete
  11. You have not spoken about the Ghoshals......they also came along with the four other Brahmins (upadhyayas) from Kanyakubj or Kannauj. Nagendranath Basu in his 16 volume history of Bengal has dealt in details.

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    Replies
    1. No one had migrated from Konouj. There is no historical truth in it. These are the stories made by the then intellectuals/learned people for their own interest and there was was no one to challenge them, as the king was on the side of intellectuals.

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    2. What is the reason they made up this story ?

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  12. Dear Mr. Sampan Chakraborty and Mr. Deva,
    First let me thank you both for your comments.
    My reply:
    1) It may please be noted that “Kulin” indicate that they were the practitioners of Kula System. and the great reformer lord Matsendra Nath introduced this. The first temple of Kula or Sakti is the Kalighat temple, which is also designated as one of the Adi-Sakti Pith by Vedic people. This temple was founded by none other than Lord Goroksha Nath, and the 1st Priest was Chourangi Nath, on whose name the place and road of Kolkata was named as Chourangi and Chourangi Road respectively.
    2) It was King Ballala Sena who introduced Vedic Caste system in Bengal. Prior to that there was no caste system in Bengal and it used to be name of the Profession. Roughly we can say all were Naths or Padas. They were not followers of Vedic system. the naming itself is an indication towards this. eg. in Punjab the names normally ended with Indra (Vedic Devata), like Darmendra, Jitendra, Mahindra, Ravindra etc, but in Bengal the same name is termed as Dharmendranath, Jeetendranath, Mahendranath, Rabindranath etc.
    3) True, I have considered only Upadhyayas as the powerful and intellectuals who are Rarhi category of Brahmins. Similarly Kulins are there in Barendra bhumi also, who are categorized as Barendra Brahmin.
    My intentions are only to find out the origin of Kulinism, not to find out the origin of Banerjee, Chatterjee, Mukherjee or Ganguli. I may be excused for the omission of Barendra Kulins.
    Most of the Barendra Kulins were Jamindars or big land Lords and dominated the social and political system of Barendra Bhumi.
    At a later date, they themselves made several groups, sections and sub section not only among themselves but did so for the entire society. The result of this was very tragic and even today all of us are paying the price for that. Because, the unity among the people were lost and during foreign invasion the Bengalis failed to protect their own Motherland and Afghani people of Islamic faith became the “Bhagya Bidhata” of Bengalis and thereafter , it went to Britishers of Christian faith and we are now paying for this…
    I have not followed the method of traditional historians, but the procedure of analytic and logical reasoning, as practiced in scientific research.
    Thank you very much Sir.

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    Replies
    1. "The worst feature of the caste is that it suppresses competition, and the checking of competition has really been the cause of the political downfall of India and its conquest by foreign races."


      — From Complete Works of Swami Vivekananda,
      Volume 8,

      Notes of Class Talks and Lectures,
      THE PEOPLE OF INDIA,

      (Report of a lecture delivered in Oakland on Monday, March 19, 1900,
      with
      editorial comments of the Oakland Enquirer)

      “Why amongst the poor of India so many are Mohammedans? It is nonsense to say, they were converted by the sword. It was to gain their liberty from the . . . zemindars and from the . . . priest, and as a consequence you find in Bengal there are more Mohammedans than Hindus amongst the cultivators, because there were so many zemindars there. Who thinks of raising these sunken downtrodden millions? A few thousand graduates do not make a nation, a few rich men do not make a nation. True, our opportunities are less, but still there is enough to feed and clothe and made 300 millions more comfortable, nay, luxurious. Ninety per cent of our people are without education — who thinks of that? — these Babus, the so-called patriots?”
      — From Complete Works of Swami Vivekananda,

      Volume 8,
      Epistles – Fourth Series,
      XXXIV Diwanji

      "The Mohammedan conquest of India came as a salvation to the downtrodden, to the poor. That is why one-fifth of our people have become Mohammedans. It was not the sword that did it all. It would be the height of madness to think it was all the work of sword and fire. And one-fifth — one-half — of your Madras people will become Christians if you do not take care.”


      — From: Complete Works of Swami Vivekananda,

      Volume 3, Lectures from Colombo to Almora,

      THE FUTURE OF INDIA

      The first Prime Minister of independent India, Jawaharlal Nehru, says about the spread of Islam in India: "The impact of the invaders from the north-west and of Islam on India had been considerable. It had pointed out and shown up the abuses that had crept into Hindu society -the petrifaction of caste, untouchability, exclusiveness, carried to fantastic lengths. This idea of brotherhood of Islam and of the theoretical equality of its adherents made a powerful appeal, especially to those in the Hindu fold who were denied any semblance of equal treatments. From this ideological impact grew up various movements aiming at a religious synthesis. Many conversions also took place but the great majority of these were from the lower castes, especially in Bengal. Some individuals belonging to the higher castes also adopted the new faith, either because of a real change of belief, or, more often, for political and economic reasons. There were obvious advantages in accepting the religion of the ruling power."
      — Jawaharlal Nehru, The Discovery of India,
      Jawaharlal Nehru Memorial Fund,
      Teen Murti House, New Delhi,
      1982, P.265.

      Delete
    2. "Let the Hindus of Bengal and the Punjab consider which alternative they should prefer. It seems to me that the moment has come when the high-caste Hindus of Bengal and the Punjab should be told that if they propose to resist Pakistan, because it cuts off a field for gainful employment, they are committing the greatest blunder. The time for successfully maintaining in their own hands a monopoly of place and power is gone. They may cheat the lower orders of the Hindus in the name of nationalism, but they cannot cheat the Muslim majorities in the Muslim Provinces and keep their monopoly of place and power. The resolution of the Hindus—if their cry against Pakistan can be regarded as such— to live under a Muslim majority and oppose self-determination may be a very courageous thing. But it will not be a very wise thing if the Hindus believe that they will be able to maintain their place and power by fooling the Musalmans. As Lincoln said, it is not possible to fool all people for all times. If the Hindus choose to live under a Muslim majority, the chances are that they may lose all. On the other hand, if the Hindus of Bengal and the Punjab agree to separate, true, they will not get more, but they will certainly not lose all."

      — PAKISTAN OR THE PARTITION OF INDIA
      BY Dr. B. R. AMBEDKAR,
      PART II—HINDU CASE AGAINST PAKISTAN,
      CHAPTER VI—Pakistan and Communal Peace

      Delete
  13. Thanks Deva.Actually we are Ganguly(Savarna gotra),but my grandfather got the surname Chakraborty from Zaminder of Bengal.
    Nobel breakthroughs from Bengali Kulin Brahmin:Tagore and Subhas Mukherjee.Mukherjee who created IVF in 1978 died in 1981,hence missed 2010 Nobel in medicine.Amartya Sen is Baidya Brahmin(they are Brahmin who became physicians).

    Anirban Banerjee of Harvard who won Nobel laureate signature award winner is Kulin Brahmin.Our family inventor Arpan Chakraborty,my uncle inventor Amit Chakraborty are Kulin Brahmin too.Subham Banerjee,Silicon Valley's youngest inventor entrepreneur is Kulin Brahmin too.
    Regards,
    Sampan Chakraborty

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    Replies
    1. Nice to Know. Thank You very much for this lovely sharing.

      Delete
    2. Add Sir U.N.Bramhachari who was Kulin Brahmin too and should have won Nobel prize.I guess Sitarist Ravishankar was Kulin too,although his surname was Chowdhury.

      Delete
  14. Please share more information of the origin of Rudraj Brahmins in Bengal and east India and the lineage of Navnath. Please give information of Lord Bindunath, the Gotrapita of Shiva gotra , supposed to be the Lord behind Yogi Nath Sampradaya in Bengal and adjoining areas.

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  15. Sir can you please say how would rudraraj brahmins from shiv gotra conduct their death rituals

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  16. Sir can you please say how would rudraraj brahmins from shiv gotra conduct their death rituals

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    Replies
    1. I also tried to find it out. but nothing worth is found out.
      The probable reason might be lack of education of this present community, the educated people of ancient times became Bramhin during the time of formation of Caste.

      Delete
    2. Why some Naths want to declare themselves as bramhan ? i dont understand that.
      I know very simple thing. If a community is educated, rich and powerful, then they are respected by all and their God is also respected. Beside this, other communities will be eager to have certain relation with such communities.
      On the other hand, if a community is uneducated, uncultured, poor no one comes to them. This is the reality.

      Delete
  17. Thank You Mr. Santanu.
    You may please go thru the topic "Nath religion" written by me.

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  22. Dear Sir....
    How are you?
    Sir,... I have Complete go thro' your research paper about "Nath religion" and 'Kulin Brahmin history'.... Now, My biggest question is "Why do Chakraborty and other high class Brahmins and also high class people abuse Nath / Debnath religion....?" They say.... "Nath/Debnath" are very low caste and have no status in society.... Sir, I am very upset about this matter...
    I am from Tinsukia. Assam. India.

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    Replies
    1. This is little Controversial.
      Most of intellectual and powerful Naths of ancient India, had all embraced Bramhinism or Vedic social social system. The leftout remains as Naths in a simple way. Later on futher down trodden people had embraced Islam en mass (where unity was more). the leftout people who did not accept the Vedic social system were treated as inferior, who failed to move with time. There was probably lack of unity among themselves, as a result neither Vedic nor Islam was interested for them.
      Our history was not the real history , but manipulated one over almost 1000 yrs. Hence very difficult to find out. However, the above may be possible reasons. the same was opined by Prof. Ramamurthy Tripathy.

      Delete
    2. "The worst feature of the caste is that it suppresses competition, and the checking of competition has really been the cause of the political downfall of India and its conquest by foreign races."



      — From Complete Works of Swami Vivekananda,
      Volume 8,

      Notes of Class Talks and Lectures,
      THE PEOPLE OF INDIA,

      (Report of a lecture delivered in Oakland on Monday, March 19, 1900,
      with
      editorial comments of the Oakland Enquirer)



      “Why amongst the poor of India so many are Mohammedans? It is nonsense to say, they were converted by the sword. It was to gain their liberty from the . . . zemindars and from the . . . priest, and as a consequence you find in Bengal there are more Mohammedans than Hindus amongst the cultivators, because there were so many zemindars there. Who thinks of raising these sunken downtrodden millions? A few thousand graduates do not make a nation, a few rich men do not make a nation. True, our opportunities are less, but still there is enough to feed and clothe and made 300 millions more comfortable, nay, luxurious. Ninety per cent of our people are without education — who thinks of that? — these Babus, the so-called patriots?”

      — From Complete Works of Swami Vivekananda,

      Volume 8,
      Epistles – Fourth Series,
      XXXIV Diwanji



      "The Mohammedan conquest of India came as a salvation to the downtrodden, to the poor. That is why one-fifth of our people have become Mohammedans. It was not the sword that did it all. It would be the height of madness to think it was all the work of sword and fire. And one-fifth — one-half — of your Madras people will become Christians if you do not take care.”



      — From: Complete Works of Swami Vivekananda,

      Volume 3, Lectures from Colombo to Almora,

      THE FUTURE OF INDIA



      The first Prime Minister of independent India, Jawaharlal Nehru, says about the spread of Islam in India: "The impact of the invaders from the north-west and of Islam on India had been considerable. It had pointed out and shown up the abuses that had crept into Hindu society -the petrifaction of caste, untouchability, exclusiveness, carried to fantastic lengths. This idea of brotherhood of Islam and of the theoretical equality of its adherents made a powerful appeal, especially to those in the Hindu fold who were denied any semblance of equal treatments. From this ideological impact grew up various movements aiming at a religious synthesis. Many conversions also took place but the great majority of these were from the lower castes, especially in Bengal. Some individuals belonging to the higher castes also adopted the new faith, either because of a real change of belief, or, more often, for political and economic reasons. There were obvious advantages in accepting the religion of the ruling power."

      — Jawaharlal Nehru, The Discovery of India,
      Jawaharlal Nehru Memorial Fund,
      Teen Murti House, New Delhi,
      1982, P.265.

      Delete
    3. "Let the Hindus of Bengal and the Punjab consider which alternative they should prefer. It seems to me that the moment has come when the high-caste Hindus of Bengal and the Punjab should be told that if they propose to resist Pakistan, because it cuts off a field for gainful employment, they are committing the greatest blunder. The time for successfully maintaining in their own hands a monopoly of place and power is gone. They may cheat the lower orders of the Hindus in the name of nationalism, but they cannot cheat the Muslim majorities in the Muslim Provinces and keep their monopoly of place and power. The resolution of the Hindus—if their cry against Pakistan can be regarded as such— to live under a Muslim majority and oppose self-determination may be a very courageous thing. But it will not be a very wise thing if the Hindus believe that they will be able to maintain their place and power by fooling the Musalmans. As Lincoln said, it is not possible to fool all people for all times. If the Hindus choose to live under a Muslim majority, the chances are that they may lose all. On the other hand, if the Hindus of Bengal and the Punjab agree to separate, true, they will not get more, but they will certainly not lose all."

      — PAKISTAN OR THE PARTITION OF INDIA
      BY Dr. B. R. AMBEDKAR,
      PART II—HINDU CASE AGAINST PAKISTAN,
      CHAPTER VI—Pakistan and Communal Peace

      Delete
    4. "Education is the manifestation of the perfection already in man."

      — From Complete Works of Swami Vivekananda, Volume 4,
      Writings: Prose, WHAT WE BELIEVE IN
      (Written to "Kidi" on March 3, 1894, from Chicago.)

      Delete
    5. Thank you for your comments. Let me try to reply , connected with this article.
      I do agree with your view that Casteism is the worst enemy of Hinduism. Caste was not in existence prior to Lord Adi Sankaracharya. It was he who introduced first.
      1) His name was Sankara Nambudripad. This last name indicates that initially he was a a Buddhist. During his period Kanchi was famous for Kanchi University, which was founded by King Asoka of Pataliputra. It was a seat of Buddism and entire Buddhism in Sourthern India was under its control. Sankara first made a division among all staffs, Professors and intellectuals were declared as Bramhan and the benifit awarded to them is the heredetory functioning. You can not find other than Bramhins as disciple of Sankaracharya. In north it was not smooth, there he reoroganised Dashnami sects (Naga Sadhus), which was originally formed by Lord Shiva. With these warrior sects , he captured important Buddhists and Jaina temple and converted them as Shiva /Vishnu temple, under the control of South Indian Bramhins. He converted Badridham (a Buddhist Shrine) into Vishnu temple, Kedar dham (A Adinath Jaina temple) as Shiva temple. Incidentally he was killed at Kedar dham by his opposition.
      However, Ramakrishna, Swamijee though speaks against casteism, but never worked to implement the same. Earlier to them Chaitanyo Mahaprabhu also tried and was successful to certain extent, For this he had paid also, when he was killed inside the Jagannath Temple by the then priest community.
      But nowhere such things were recorded, the fact should be justified if one consider the circumstial events and analyse the same.
      The power of division is very powerful and will continue to remain,
      when the community as a whole are uneducated and poor.

      Delete
    6. "When Buddhism broke down everything by introducing all sorts of foreign barbarians into India — their manners and customs and things — there was a reaction, and that reaction was led by a young monk [Shankarâchârya]. And [instead] of preaching new doctrines and always thinking new thoughts and making sects, he brought back the Vedas to life: and modern Hinduism has thus an admixture of ancient Hinduism, over which the Vedantists predominate. But, you see, what once dies never comes back to life, and those ceremonials of [Hinduism] never came back to life. You will be astonished if I tell you that, according to the old ceremonials, he is not a good Hindu who does not eat beef. On certain occasions he must sacrifice a bull and eat it."

      — Complete Works of Swami Vivekananda, Volume 3,
      BUDDHISTIC INDIA
      (Reproduced from the Swami Vivekananda Centenary Memorial Volume, published by the Swami Vivekananda Centenary, Calcutta, in 1963.
      The additions in square brackets have been made for purposes of clarification. Periods indicate probable omissions. — Publisher.)
      (Delivered at the Shakespeare Club, Pasadena, California, on February 2, 1900)

      Delete
    7. "... The one thing that is at the root of all evils in India is the condition of the poor. The poor in the West are devils; compared to them ours are angels, and it is therefore so much the easier to raise our poor. The only service to be done for our lower classes is to give them education, to develop their lost individuality. That is the great task between our people and princes. Up to now nothing has been done in that direction. Priest-power and foreign conquest have trodden them down for centuries, and at last the poor of India have forgotten that they are human beings. They are to be given ideas; their eyes are to be opened to what is going on in the world around them; and then they will work out their own salvation. Every nation, every man and every woman must work out their own salvation. Give them ideas — that is the only help they require, and then the rest must follow as the effect. Ours is to put the chemicals together, the crystallization comes in the law of nature. Our duty is to put ideas into their heads, they will do the rest. This is what is to be done in India. It is this idea that has been in my mind for a long time. I could not accomplish it in India, and that was the reason of my coming to this country. The great difficulty in the way of educating the poor is this. Supposing even your Highness opens a free school in every village, still it would do no good, for the poverty in India is such, that the poor boys would rather go to help their fathers in the fields, or otherwise try to make a living, than come to the school. Now if the mountain does not come to Mohammed, Mohammed must go to the mountain. If the poor boy cannot come to education, education must go to him. There are thousands of single-minded, self-sacrificing Sannyâsins in our own country, going from village to village, teaching religion. If some of them can be organised as teachers of secular things also, they will go from place to place, from door to door, not only preaching, but teaching also. Suppose two of these men go to a village in the evening with a camera, a globe, some maps, etc. They can teach a great deal of astronomy and geography to the ignorant. By telling stories about different nations, they can give the poor a hundred times more information through the ear than they can get in a lifetime through books. This requires an organization, which again means money. Men enough there are in India to work out this plan, but alas! they have no money. It is very difficult to set a wheel in motion; but when once set, it goes on with increasing velocity. After seeking help in my own country and failing to get any sympathy from the rich, I came over to this country through your Highness' aid. The Americans do not care a bit whether the poor of India die or live. And why should they, when our own people never think of anything but their own selfish ends?

      My noble Prince, this life is short, the vanities of the world are transient, but they alone live who live for others, the rest are more dead than alive. One such high, noble-minded, and royal son of India as your Highness can do much towards raising India on her feet again and thus leave a name to posterity which shall be worshipped. ..."

      — Complete Works of Swami Vivekananda,
      Volume 4, Writings: Prose,
      OUR DUTY TO THE MASSES
      (Written from Chicago to H. H. the Maharaja of Mysore on June 23, 1894.)

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  23. I am not a bengali but gujarati , and a pediatrician by profession at the same time keen interest in history also. I am glad to read this discussion ,well , I am nobody to comment on the migration and origin of kulin bengali brahmins as I am not an expert in this field.However I would only comment that what the Europeans has written about the history of India all is not correct for example Colonel Todd ,Kinkaide has written history of Rajputana and The outlaws of Kathiawar written by Kincaid
    ( Kathiawar a part of gujarat also known as Saurashtra and is known for Valour and chivalary) many portions of the history is twisted . I would rather appreciate Indian historian Hon. Gaurishankar Oza and Hon. Jadunath Sarkar. Well as far as migrations of Brahmins are concerned ,there are migrations not to go far away being a bhardwaja brahmin born in Rajasthan belonging to Gujarat . My father belonged to kathiawar and migrated to rajasthan some 70 years ago ,I have remigrated to Gujrat again. We are Audichya sahastra brahmin ,Audichya in sankrit means North and we have migrated from north India to Gujarat somwhere around 950 - 1000 AD to gujarat on the invitation of Gujarat king Mulraj Solanki as the original brahmins called Srimali Brahmins refused to perform Yagna hence 1000 family of brahmins were invited they belonged to Uttarakhand ,Kannauj and kashi. The south Indian brahmins specially Naboodiri brahmins are gaud brahmins migrated from north India. There has been migrations of Brahmins all over India either due to one or other reason but the only short comings of our ancient history is that we Indian were not good historians to keep a record most of the history was passed verbally from generations to generations example is VEDA itself. In fact the history of India has been written ,with the details are taken from foreign historians like Megasthanes or huen tsang ,fahiyan ,Alberuni and many others. There were migrations of lot of people from outside India ,within inside India and even intermarriages of various castes and even Brahmins hence it is very difficult to comment on Indian history as a whole. Thanks .

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    1. To certain extent I do agree with your views.
      Migration or movement of the people were in existence from the very beginning in search of food. However, I think, it was not that high with respect to today's World. Now can we trace out English, Mughals, Turks, etc ? Therefore these do not change the basic structure of the society and race in general. On the other hand, outsiders always accept the local customs and rituals and merged with the locals. Further everywhere intellectuals are available, who in course of time they embraced Vedic social system. But caste was unknown prior to Adi Sankaracharya, who became a smartha from Saivaites. I think it was he who imposed the caste system in to India. His followers in South of India are all bramhins and not a single non bramhins. This is a big issue. In Vedas, Smrities (modified), we can not find caste. Bramhan, kshatriyas etc were the designation of profession. Even in Upanishads it was not mentioned. At Bhagavat Gita , you may find the hidden agenda of Gita, as first preached by Lord Adi Sankaracharya. If you read His Prasthantrayee, you may find where the seed of castesim was hidden. Later on it developed further and become a big baniyan tree.
      Thank you Sir for your enlightenment.

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  24. Just to mention to Dr.kk Debnath sir if you happen to read this,my elder brother is also retired from IIT delhi as Professor in cilvil engg. and incidentally he has also his M.E. from Roorke.

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  25. God knows who are who, at first i want to say. For Dr. K.K. Debnath's research work i appreciate him surely. But, i feel all these systems like caste, creed, religion etc. are useless in the modern world of present century. Improving relation of Soul with the Supreme Soul is basic thing in all kinds of spiritual fields. Religion is a way only. In the name of upper caste many uncivilized injustice were caused to so named lower caste people. For the Supreme being all are same before Him. He reads no castes, creed and does not count the importance of relationship between or among human beings. He sees only Soul. Examples are available in Puran, Bhagawat Gita and in other holly books. For example, Hironya Kashhap was the father of Prahlad, Lord Shree Hari flayed him and never forgiven him though he was the father of Prahlad. He counts no relationship, it's clear. Again Haridas was a cobbler but he got Divine bless from Lord Shree Hari. This things had already been cleared in the past. For me one is kulin who bears the perfect human qualities and never hates other in the name of castes and perfectly civilized. Thanks

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    1. "The worst feature of the caste is that it suppresses competition, and the checking of competition has really been the cause of the political downfall of India and its conquest by foreign races."

      — From Complete Works of Swami Vivekananda,
      Volume 8, Notes of Class Talks and Lectures,
      THE PEOPLE OF INDIA,
      (Report of a lecture delivered in Oakland on Monday, March 19, 1900,
      with editorial comments of the Oakland Enquirer)

      “Why amongst the poor of India so many are Mohammedans? It is nonsense to say, they were converted by the sword. It was to gain their liberty from the . . . zemindars and from the . . . priest, and as a consequence you find in Bengal there are more Mohammedans than Hindus amongst the cultivators, because there were so many zemindars there. Who thinks of raising these sunken downtrodden millions? A few thousand graduates do not make a nation, a few rich men do not make a nation. True, our opportunities are less, but still there is enough to feed and clothe and made 300 millions more comfortable, nay, luxurious. Ninety per cent of our people are without education — who thinks of that? — these Babus, the so-called patriots?”

      — From Complete Works of Swami Vivekananda,
      Volume 8,Epistles – Fourth Series,
      XXXIV Diwanji

      "The Mohammedan conquest of India came as a salvation to the downtrodden, to the poor. That is why one-fifth of our people have become Mohammedans. It was not the sword that did it all. It would be the height of madness to think it was all the work of sword and fire. And one-fifth — one-half — of your Madras people will become Christians if you do not take care.”

      — From: Complete Works of Swami Vivekananda,
      Volume 3, Lectures from Colombo to Almora,
      THE FUTURE OF INDIA

      The first Prime Minister of independent India, Jawaharlal Nehru, says about the spread of Islam in India: "The impact of the invaders from the north-west and of Islam on India had been considerable. It had pointed out and shown up the abuses that had crept into Hindu society -the petrifaction of caste, untouchability, exclusiveness, carried to fantastic lengths. This idea of brotherhood of Islam and of the theoretical equality of its adherents made a powerful appeal, especially to those in the Hindu fold who were denied any semblance of equal treatments. From this ideological impact grew up various movements aiming at a religious synthesis. Many conversions also took place but the great majority of these were from the lower castes, especially in Bengal. Some individuals belonging to the higher castes also adopted the new faith, either because of a real change of belief, or, more often, for political and economic reasons. There were obvious advantages in accepting the religion of the ruling power."
      — Jawaharlal Nehru, The Discovery of India,
      Jawaharlal Nehru Memorial Fund,
      Teen Murti House, New Delhi,
      1982, P.265.

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    2. "Let the Hindus of Bengal and the Punjab consider which alternative they should prefer. It seems to me that the moment has come when the high-caste Hindus of Bengal and the Punjab should be told that if they propose to resist Pakistan, because it cuts off a field for gainful employment, they are committing the greatest blunder. The time for successfully maintaining in their own hands a monopoly of place and power is gone. They may cheat the lower orders of the Hindus in the name of nationalism, but they cannot cheat the Muslim majorities in the Muslim Provinces and keep their monopoly of place and power. The resolution of the Hindus—if their cry against Pakistan can be regarded as such— to live under a Muslim majority and oppose self-determination may be a very courageous thing. But it will not be a very wise thing if the Hindus believe that they will be able to maintain their place and power by fooling the Musalmans. As Lincoln said, it is not possible to fool all people for all times. If the Hindus choose to live under a Muslim majority, the chances are that they may lose all. On the other hand, if the Hindus of Bengal and the Punjab agree to separate, true, they will not get more, but they will certainly not lose all."

      — PAKISTAN OR THE PARTITION OF INDIA
      BY Dr. B. R. AMBEDKAR,
      PART II—HINDU CASE AGAINST PAKISTAN,
      CHAPTER VI—Pakistan and Communal Peace

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    3. "Education is the manifestation of the perfection already in man."

      — From Complete Works of Swami Vivekananda, Volume 4,
      Writings: Prose, WHAT WE BELIEVE IN
      (Written to "Kidi" on March 3, 1894, from Chicago.)

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  26. Most famous Kulin Brahmins are:
    Tagore
    Subhas Mukherjee(ivf Nobel in 2010 in medicine)
    Sir U.N.Bramhachari(He had maximum nominations in 1942 in field of medicine with 5 persons nominated him,but no Nobel prize was awarded in that year).But saving millions of lives is lot more important than winning a medal from Royal Swedish academy.

    Famous Kulin Brahmin inventors:
    Arpan Chakraborty
    Subham Banerjee.
    Nilanjan Mukherjee.
    Dwip.N.Banerjee.

    Among these 4 inventors, 3 are my family members.I have also more than 100 million people as twitter followers around the world or even international space station.

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  27. Thanks sir very interesting research of yours..logically explains me many things at a time....
    Sir,can you please give some explanation on d following:
    The same characters ,rituals and that "kanyakubj coming stories" with my ancestral lineage.And we hv tara tarini temple (one out of 4 adi shakti peetha,towards which i hv special attachment) nearby village GANJAM dist....but i belongs to utkal brahmin having surname Mahapatra given by king which ws previously satpathy ,gotra Bharadwaj........
    So,can u please favour me to explain,we too hv d same historic facts explained by you,befor,fr bengali kulin brahmins.......or there is no difference between bengali n odia kulin brahmins....bcoz somewhere i hv read utkal brahmins r also kulin brahmins.....plz explain sir

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  28. Thanks sir very interesting research of yours..logically explains me many things at a time....
    Sir,can you please give some explanation on d following:
    The same characters ,rituals and that "kanyakubj coming stories" with my ancestral lineage.And we hv tara tarini temple (one out of 4 adi shakti peetha,towards which i hv special attachment) nearby village GANJAM dist....but i belongs to utkal brahmin having surname Mahapatra given by king which ws previously satpathy ,gotra Bharadwaj........
    So,can u please favour me to explain,we too hv d same historic facts explained by you,befor,fr bengali kulin brahmins.......or there is no difference between bengali n odia kulin brahmins....bcoz somewhere i hv read utkal brahmins r also kulin brahmins.....plz explain sir

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  30. Sir I am very much impressed by your research and I request you to please edit and add the wikipedia information in details to have a broader information available on internet about Debnath caste. And also please add..Other that Debnath and Nath what are the other surnames used by Shiva Gothra. As I stay in Karnataka..Here lingayats are shiva gotra and match exactly the Debnath criteria..Could you please enlighten little on that also

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    1. There is a separate article on Nathism. Nath is a separate religion and it is not a caste or a sampradaya as commoner perceived today. You may go thru the article. I have not covered after Lord Matsendra Nath in the article, it is about Nath religion prior to Matsendra Nath.
      Regarding Karnataka of today, I do agree to certain extent with your views on Lingayats (I suggest you to go thru the book " The origins of Virasaiva Sects" by RR. Blake Michael; Motilal Banarsidass Pubs. Pvt. Ltd).
      The Gowdas are also Naths and their main Matha known as "Adichunchungiri Kaal Bhairava math". This Matha was established by Matsendra Nath.
      Beside the above, there is one more community by name "Yogi Nath or Yogi" is also available in Karnataka. Their HQ is at Mangalore, the matha is known as the Kadri Jogi Math and the nearby Manjunatha Temple was a seat of Jogi culture since the time of Matsyendranath and Gorakshanath.

      Delete
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  32. This comment has been removed by the author.

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    1. Sir, it was a fair and valid point. It was quite shocking to see the comment removed. Regards

      Delete
    2. Sree Tathagata Bhattacharya,
      No idea, I have not removed any comment, even if it was bad.
      Or It might have been removed by slip.
      I am extremely sorry for the same,

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  33. Sir,
    I have a querry. I happen to come across my family tree from a very old book " Kulasar sangraha" from national Library , Kolkata ( Published in 1885). I could trace my ancestors starting from one of the five Kulins of Kannauj,( Bharadwaj Gotra) who supposed to have migrated to bengal. I can trace my last 36 generations from that family tree. I really do not know how correct it is . But it definitely has correct names of my grand father upwards for the four generations as I knew their names.
    I would be thankful if you share your views.
    Regards
    Shankar Mukherjee

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  34. sir i mam working on masth nath math. i need your help on some topics.please provide ur email id or contact no.
    my email id
    sonikadalal24@gmail.com

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    Replies
    1. Thank You.
      my mailid is drkkebnath@gmal.com

      Delete
    2. Correct email id maybe: drkkdebnath@gmail.com

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  35. Do you really think caste or gotras matter in this present world having other more important and more relevant topics to human beings (environment, terrorism, unemployment being some)?
    Do you not think this "a Brahmin conspiracy" running for over hundreds of years now ?
    With all due respect, this blog article is promoting casteism and gives a one way directional viewpoint as at that time, ONLY upper caste persons were allowed to gain knowledge as evident from "cultural history of Bengal is primarily dominated by “Kulin Brahmins”, be it literary field, or scientific field or Medical or Engineering field or in Judiciary area or in administrative area or in political area".

    I hope that the next generation (younger millennials) will understand the UNIMPORTANCE of caste and work together for a better society and a better India.
    Thank You.

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  36. Mr.nobel prize this is a research note made by Dr. debnath about kulin brahmin . We should focus on kulin-brahmin ,at least any kind of brahmin .You misplaced Amartya Sen here. Amartya Sen is baidya, not brahmin by caste.

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  37. One take care of his children, brother, sister and other relative, which is a natural phenomenon. Now if we extend it futher, we get caste.

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  38. Are bhattacharjee kulin brahmins ..because my grandmother says so

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  39. Well informative blog.
    Heartful greetings.

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  40. Is bengali acharjee brahmin diffrent from other bengali brahmin?since in some region of bengal/Bangladesh/assam acharjee are treated inferior to other bengali brahmin...

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  41. Dear Dr K.K. Debnath, I really loved reading this article. The information was well presented and backed up by reliable references. Please do write a book on this but please do extend this to all Bengali Brahmins so that we have a better understanding of our ancestral journey. Some may say these are not useful in modern day society but I strongly believe history forgotten is civilization lost. Anyway can you kindly elaborate the root and origin of the "Vatsa" gotra and also the ancestry of Bhattacharjee brahmins? Who are they and which brahmins got this title and who gave this title and how did they get this title? Eagerly waiting for your detailed response.
    Regards
    SB

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  42. My name is Surajit Debnath I belong to which category ...m a brahmin????

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  43. Well with recent Nobel laureate in Economics Kolkata with ~50,000 Kulin Brahmin has 3 Nobel laureates and 1 chemistry Nobel plaque winner(Anirban Banerjee).

    It's the best in the world per capita because 2nd best New York Jews have ~40 Nobel with 1.75 Million population.Which means if we had 1.75 Million in Kolkata,then we would have won 110-140 Nobel total,a record as posted by Sampan Chakraborty earlier.

    -Inventor Dr.Maharaj Mukherjee:I am world record holder of winning International math Olympiad gold as well as having 300 patents application,which no other person in history has done before.
    My twitter:twitter.com/geniussambit

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  45. Reply to Mr. Biswajit,

    On Bengali Kulin Bramhins: Your reply is irrelevant to this post.
    However, Let me give my views on your comments:
    1) We are not supposed to make any adverse comments, on speakers during speech, be it political, social or religious.
    2) Adi Sankaracharya was an Advaitavadi yet he worshipped the idols of Shiva, Vishnu, Sakti etc, but deadly against worship of human, whatever he might be. He had converted all most all important temples of Jain and Buddhists and replaced / renamed them with the idols of Lord Shiva and Vishnu and Mother Goddess. Today these temples are the holiest temples for all sects of Hindus.
    3) He was honoured as an Avtar of Buddha and remover of evil practices prevailed in the then society by all, including Buddhists, Vedics, Shaivaits, Vishuvaites etc
    4) Swamijee and his order are also advaitavadi. Yet his order “Ramkrishna Math” daily worships Thakur Ramkrishna, Maa Sarodamoni devi and Swami Vivekananda as well as Maa Durga, Maa Kali. Why? Is it not in contradiction with the philosophy of Advaitavad ?
    5) The issue of religion and its philosophies are always controversial. Ultimately Jo Jita Oh Sikander ar Jo hara oh mara. This is the ultimate. If you want to discuss any issue not connected with my articles or else, you may mail to me thru my mail..
    Thank you.

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  47. "The history of all hitherto existing society is the history of class struggles. Freeman and slave, patrician and plebeian, lord and serf, guild-master and journeyman, in a word, oppressor and oppressed, stood in constant opposition to one another, carried on uninterrupted, now hidden, now open fight, a fight that each time ended, either in a revolutionary reconstitution of society at large, or in the common ruin of the contending classes"

    — Karl Marx and Frederick Engels.

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  48. I am Arnab Nath can you say me please that I am brahmin or not and can I do puja like other brahmins please answer🙏

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  49. Sir, it would be a huge help if you'll tell me who are "nath" as their surname in Maharashtra and also bihar? What is their caste and gotra?

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